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Daimler Fleetline Transmission (long post)

__. I was delivering my bus (1976 Daimler Fleetline) to be painted when the gearbox developed a fault and wouldn't shift out of first gear. At about the same time, the speedo ceased to function. I was advised by a very helpful correspondent in the UK that a fitter had told him that the auto box was provided speed info by a toothed wheel on the prop shaft and a sensor probe like those used on ABS systems.
__. When I first looked at the engine compartment of my bus, I saw a small cable (a grey plastic outer shell/ about the size of a plain pencil with a brown wire and blue wire hanging out -- both obviously broken off) hanging loose near the rear-most u-joint. I thought that that must be the problem -- now to trace it to find out where it should go. Look carefully, there's another broken wire under the gearbox housing that leads back into the area under the rear seat (lower saloon) but it has a black plastic outer shell and the wires inside are red and black with a woven earth/shield of copper strands. What are all these? Do they attach to each other? Why are they different colors?
__. So, BUDA crawls under the bus to have a look and notices that there is a horseshoe-looking fitting around the toothed wheel - and on that fitting is a stainless flange with a black plastic cap with broken stubs (1/4 inch max) of wires. But those wires are red/blue and a woven earth shield with silver coloured strands and that grey harness goes into a fitting nearby but separate.
__. What's going on here -- we have three different broken wires? So, let's trace some. At the control box (the electronic box under the upper saloon rear seat, not the electro-pneumatic unit under the lower saloon seat), there are two connectors. On is a cylindrical plug about 1 1/2" in diameter with 14 to 16 wires coming out of it. None are brown, blue, or black/red and there's no woven shield. But there's a smaller plug (marked A-B, and 8-10; it's about the diameter of your first finger) -- the wires coming from that plug are red, blue with a silver-coloured woven shield inside a black plastic harness outer shell.
__. Now, trace down that harness -- why does the lead under the seat in the upper saloon match the wires coming out of the sensor at the toothed wheel? That harness goes into a box about the size of a (ten-packet) box of cigarettes. And in that box, the red wire is attached to the red wire from under the bus, the blue wire is attached to the black wire, and the silver shield is attached to the copper shield -- that red/black/copper harness is the broken one from near the gearbox!
__. Sounds like we've got a winner! I removed the sensor at the toothed wheel - once it was out, it looked like a tube of lipstick with the flange on it and the black plastic cap with the broken wires protruding. So we crimp butt connectors to the little broken wires from the sensor (CAV 494/4) to three jumper wires, and attach the jumper wires to the harness with the red/black/copper shield wires inside. The sensor is reinstalled in it's housing at the toothed ring. But what's the grey harness with the brown and blue wires? We can't figure out where in the world they may go - there don't seem to be any other broken wires down there -- the guess is that they're the broken wires for the speedo. Oh, well, let's guess that we've got the auto box sensor hooked up again. Only a road test will tell! So, let's go. Within 40 feet, it shifts to second and then third! We're set! The toothed ring and it's sensor were the key to the repair, just as I was advised! I'm not sure that we would have been able to trace the problem and repair it without that advice. The bus ran fine back to the transmission shop but still no speedo reading -- we will have to find where the brown and blue wires attach into the wiring on the bus for that, I guess.
__. I feel that the "field repair" that we did really isn't meant to last so I'll obtain a new sensor that hasn't had the wiring leads ripped out of it. But for what we needed to do to get the bus moving again, we were successful.
Bruce Henderson, Wallace NC USA

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Re: Daimler Fleetline Transmission (long post)

My last offer for tonight.

Brown and blue wires in a grey harness are respectively live and neutral in the European household wiring convention (earth is green/yellow striped by the way). Whatever you've found is clearly a bodge and not original equipment, so it might be anything! Best of British luck! -as we say.

Re: Daimler Fleetline Transmission (long post)

__. Thank you for this information. The blue wire in the harness appears to have a slate (grey) tracer but it's hard to tell. Despite this, I'm inclined to agree that your suggestion of it's being a bodge is on mark.

__. My big problem now is that I can't find any place where the other end of the broken wire may have been broken from. I don't mind a "field-repair" (aka "bodge") to get the speedo up and running again but I can't find the wire pair that runs from the engine compartment up to the speedo.

__. A seller on EBay a couple of weeks ago was selling a Fleetline workshop manual dated 1977. This manual was advertised as having electrical diagrams and brake circuit diagrams. Unfortunately, I was outbid for this. I have a manual that I think dates from about 1972; this was provided by a very helpful correspondent. This manual is helpful in many ways but it doesn't have the electrical diagrams. Does anyone have a copy of the 1977 Fleetline manual? I'm only interested in the information so it's not necessary to get an original or historic manual -- a photocopy will be fine. Many thanks, Bruce Henderson, North Carolina USA

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Re: Daimler Fleetline Transmission (long post)

Bruce do you still have the e-bay Item number maybe I can approch the person that won it and ask to borrow the manual and make a copy of it. and then you can get a copy and the club will have one also , when ever anyone sees Bus manuals on E-bay PLEASE let me know I'll out bid most bidders becuase we have club funds just for this purpose.

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Re: Daimler Fleetline Transmission (long post)

Bruce:

I'm getting very cynical in my old age! Having found a 1977 Fleetline wiring diagram in the Keighley Bus Museum archive, the speedo generator does indeed have blue and brown wires leading from it.

Let me have your postal address and I'll send you a copy of the diagram, but in the meantime:

The brown wire goes to a line connector whence it emerges as a black wire to the rear junction box, thence it is a black & lilac wire to terminal 18 on the speedo head.

The blue wire goes to another line connector, where it becomes red as far as the rear junction box, then maroon to terminal 19 on the speedo head.

Hope this helps.

David

Daimler Fleetlines Transmission (long post)
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