:as a kid made me look at my female peers and wish i was a girl just so i wouldnt be lonely and successful
:constantly told a woman needs my utmost devotion and attention
:forced me to say things i truly did not mean like i love you then shamed and name called because i couldnt say it with sincerity
:told to shut my mouth and open my ears when speaking with girls
:have had a few relationships and they were all disasters in which it was MY FAULT even though i tried to make it work
:get intimidated around real men and feel like a weak piece of crap around my male peers
:made me give up on relationships completly as i thought they were pointless and one sided
:made me question my sanity for 15yrs
:made me live for 2yrs under constant pressure,brainwashing, panic attacks, sleepless nights, complete misery
:constantly been given the "women in ur life are a blessing, u should...". bleh b-----it i really hated that one
hey guys just wanted to share what feminism and my narc mother has done to me over the course of my childhood and would like you to share yours as well. towards the end i got a little angry typing this but i need to let it be known. TO MOM:THANK YOU FOR RUINING MY CHILDHOOD, U HAVE PUT ROCKS AND PEBBLES ON MY ROAD THROUGHOUT EVERY STAGE OF MY LIFE. U ONCE ASKED ME FOR MY HONEST OPINION IF YOU FAILED AS A MOTHER......YES!!!!!!YOU HAVE YA B--CH.YOU AND UR DA-M FEMINAZIS TRIED TO BRAINWASH ME, YOU CAME REALLY CLOSE TOO, BUT IN THE END YOU FAILED!WHY? BECAUSE IM STRONGER THAN YOU FEMINAZIS THINK.
TO DAD:YOU SUCK, THANK YOU FOR ALWAYS SITTING ON THE COUCH WATCHING FOOTBALL MY ENTIRE LIFE. THANKS FOR ONLY SPEAKING TO ME WHEN YOU WANTED SOMETHING DONE OR GIVE ME COMMANDS.THANKS FOR HAVING THE GUTS TO ACTUALLY TELL ME MY OPINIONS DID NOT COUNT, AND THAT IM BASICALLY JUST A TOOL. YOU TOLD ME ONCE THAT U FAILED AS A FATHER, YES U DID.
ty for listening guys i feel better

Alex,

I think you practically speak for me as well; the only difference was, my mother never assumed there was EVER anything wrong with HER so never asked. I had to find that out this year (at 54) from the neighbours just how wrong things in my life were. She still doesn't think anything is wrong with her.

And my dad (god bless him) did his very best to shield me from her and it cost him his life long term because he gave her everything she asked and got nothing back even in the last month of his life when dying from cancer and looking like a victim of Belsen. She sucked the very life out of him and was seeing a FNG BEFORE my dad was dead. Bi tch!

I feel your anger dude.

Feminism?

I think is the biggest con ever perpetrated on women and it’s done by women – to women in the name of women FFS (the enemy within is always the most dangerous) . They preach hatred and vilification of men with a religious zeal and wonder why men treat them badly - you reap what you sow.... be a bi tch get treated like one.

I'm all for equal rights accross the bourd. BUT don't take the p iss "ladies". Being equal does not mean deminishing others (on any grounds).

It’s bloody damaging to them more than us men - we have the option to go find a women with less of a feather up her chuff. They're the one still clucking away about rights and villifying men and wondering why no man comes near them, and then they hit the "all men are Bar - stewards" “no one understands me” routine.

Yeh we do, you’re just not worth my effort.


Find a women with half a IQ point and she’ll ignore feminism for the fundamental sh it it is.

Nice thread Alex.

For me, my parents weren't really involved with me growing up. That is until I hit a growth spurt and my dad suddenly wanted me to be a superstar in every sport on the planet. My dad and I have reconciled, and I realize now that he is a narcissist. I also know that he had a horrific childhood, and a very hard life. So, I can let that go, but I still feel the pain. The biggest pain I feel is just exhaustion. I could never do enough or be good enough to please my parents. They never showed affection nor were they very nurturing, just demanding. Plus, I was never permitted to express any of my wants and needs. When I did I was belittled.

Now, with very little parental involvement when I was young, I would watch a good bit of tv. MASH was my favorite show. I modeled my life after Alan Alda's Hawkeye Pierce character. I think it really hurt me in my life. Hawkeye was sensitive, caring, and a drinker to unwind. I drank a lot in my younger years. I was caring. I bought into the media's model of a man who was sensitive to women's needs. I wanted to be the best lover, caretaker, and all around everything a man could be.
I learned to put women on a pedestal. I put their needs first and mine second. The results have been terrible.
I never picked up any relaxing hobbies. I never went on nice manly trips. I never had any fun, except if it was located in the bottom of a liquor bottle.
What has it gotten me? I still have no collections or hobbies. Just some old books I picked up at cheap prices. I gave away all my earnings to my family. My health isn't very good, even though I lift. I just have a general feeling of malaise. I can't quite get over the hump so to speak.

I did everything for everyone else thinking that in the end, there would be some appreciation and love. I thought love was something you earned by being good enough.
I was never good enough. Even though I nearly killed myself and wrecked my health trying to attain perfection.
Feminism had a lot to do with my crappy life. I always thought women were to be admired. Women were to be adorned, no matter what their behavior. I gave until I had nothing left to give.
At 46 I am picking up the pieces of what is left and trying to re-establish myself.

for this reason


Please get involved with A Voice For Men . com

1. Amplified the spirit of Jezebel that within most females:
normal human selfishness + feminized entitlement = Self centeriness (Jezebel or Nar)
2.Give women power over men
3. Destroy the Family
4. Give women some crazy Ideal of what a man should be. ( I was born with a penis not a cape)
5. So on.....

This thread is taking the path of ascension of a slippery slope that may be based upon emotionalism disguised as rationalism. Permanent personal grieving or fixated rage is nothing more than the self perpetuation of our original perceived or actual abuse. To change our personal feelings and attitudes about a collective segment of people based upon our negative experiences with a few is indeed a sub-conscience collaboration with our original abusers and a perpetuation and continuation of that abuse and conduct that is now being afflicted upon us and the chosen "them" by our very own selves. For me this strikes me as a recreation of our horrible experience to now be delivered upon what we may be mistakenly interpret as the assumptive collective "enemy". In simple terms we may become the very thing we abhor and detest. I for one am a bit of a "Baron Munchausen" and genuinely am quite fond of the"feminine"gender. I am not fond of the "feminism" nutty fringe. These are two totally separate entities. Therefore if we are to take a combative defensive stance and lump all women into this fringe vocal group what head way are we to make in our own personal lives in creating harmony and "fair and equal" balance between the genders that is satisfying and workable if we stand with clenched fists. I do believe that by trusting and loving anew is one powerful path for me to actually annul the original abuse and the damage thereof. It is the one of the ways for me to take away her power and the way to terminate and evict the wounded space that is rented in my head. Personally where the women folk are concerned I would rather lead than argue, f**k than fight, love than hate. I firmly believe that women generally are being sold a bill of faulty goods by ultra vocal lesbian leftist "feminist" agenda dogmatists and in the end analysis it will be a complete social failure because it is based upon isolationist separatism that is unsustainable in a collective culture. I have seen this in my life. I honestly believe and can attest to the fact that there is a LARGE group of women out there who are finding this to be a coldly true experience and are wanting and looking and needing for strong and decent men who are capable of understanding this quandary and are interested in being a part of a new vanguard of change and forgiveness and are willing to enter into relationships that are based upon equality anchored upon mutual and equal respect and justice as opposed to entitled and owed separate "rights". Hell even Gloria Stienheim eventually married. I suggest we as men review what we are requiring in a life mate and partner and disregard and dismiss the unworthy and confusingly damaged vocalists and or personality disordered and focus on the worthy and sane because believe it or not they are actually out there. We may be simply looking in the wrong places and perhaps at misguided surface qualifications. Beauty is not just skin deep after all. And yes I think the Violence Against Women Act is an unfortunate tragedy and a travesty and should be balanced with a Violence Against Men Act. Therefor I do support a voice for men in this culture but not at the cost of disregarding all women.

Hear hear BB

but please?????.....paragraphs! please for us a little older...

I agree (and I'm sure I've said previously on another thread) it IS dangerous to lump all women together. I never have nor will lump them together - each is an individual and I will always respect that individuality. Also I'll stand up and say I like women (does that make ME a lesbian? )

To do otherwise, makes us no better than a member of the outer fringe feminist groups. But men have been passively and not so passively vilified across the Western world since the 70's (maybe 60s) via every available medium. This has just encouraged the less than secure women to latch on to a way of being that they think is right and they believe will both encourage respect across the genders. How many songs and female artistes today preach that ****** is the way to be. I'm all for girl power (oh god thats so 90s ) but not at the expense of men.

The Problem with that thinking is it's created as BB said by ultra vocal lesbian leftist "feminist" dogmatists and ISN'T in the best interest of women as a whole. Its a sad case of the weak being lead by nutty/stupid/deranged women who genially believe they speak for ALL women and wonder why their left standing or they concede and come in from the outer fringes. Then they join the rest of us (men and women) who "get" that the hamster (thanks for that ) isn't exactly the right part of the brain to be conducting adult life with, and that some truisms are just that...true.

It takes two to make a couple.

But we're just men........what the frack do we know.....

We know what we will put up with and what isn't worth the fight.

The other issue is too many families have no male role model or loose the male role model or have a poor male role model so todays girl children grow up with a reenforced very negative idle of what a man is (or should be). Further more if the male is absent the belief that mom did without dad - so can I prevails, (I've heard this too many times from single mothers in work). It creates a vicious circle.

In the western world women are no longer chastised if they have a child out of wedlock (or any other stable couple relationship). In the UK it's too often seen as a way to leave home and establish your an adult. The state will provide everything for you. In the UK just now it's a major drain on the wealth of the nation and massive social concern that no politician has the balls to rectify or he faces the wrath of the feminists and (god forbid) that hornets nest of Mumsnet.

check it out....

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable



There is no shame, or risk associated with single mother childbirth anymore and it encourages too many with no male role model. Someone will care for them both.

JMHO

birdboy, i dont know why but when i read ur response to this thread i feel insulted and my venting disregarded. It feels like i just completly opened myself up for all to see and at the end of it been told to just get over it.that being said its probably not the case at all and i dont exactly know my own feelings 100%, or even if they are my feelings(wierd i know).

That's understandable Alex. There are two reasons why you may have construed my comments as personally dismissive. One, I may be a bit older than you and perhaps further out in my hard core no contact with the PDI. Two, I happen to have developed a satisfactory relationship with a normal woman who reveals and discusses with me the female perspective about the short change delivered to both women and men as a result of the false promises of the left feminist movement.

I feel overall your observations are legitimate for some segments of the western female mind set, although certainly not the rule. You can ask most single women in their later thirties and forties if they are happy and satisfied with the modern single life and you will find that the majority of them are not.

I think we should also keep in mind that the male modern population has it's own problems to deal with exclusive and separate from the issues concerning the present feminist movement, which by the way has toned down considerably in the past twenty years.

Hopefully I will not be vilified for my observation and belief that the present alarming rise in narcissism and personality disorders is equally dispersed between both the male and female genders.

Feminism is an attack on Femininity.

http://jwa.org/feminism/

Didja mean lak dis?

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s2M6JUFCCSA&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Ds2M6JUFCCSA

I agree that any one-sided group, such as feminists, are wrong.
But so are, white supremacists. Look at black liberation theology. And all the hate and vitriol. Trying to "exclude" any "contamination" from European influence, implying as if the white race actions can only be like venom evil.

These are groups that promote the subjugation of others or the EXCLUSION of others, or inferiority of others or domination over others.
None of these groups are healthy nor God-based.

Now, I will lay it down for you plain and simple. You may love it you may hate it, but: You have to forgive your mother and father if you REALLY want to overcome their damage on you and heal your heart.

Feminism and moms that are too insolent, are a PRODUCT of some type of internalized LACKING or offense, which makes them want to demand respect in the WRONG WAY or creates a seed of revenge inside, which gives rise to these attitudes.

A woman was made by God to be loved by a man,
A man made to be LOVED by a woman, not dominated, or controlled.
And vice versa.
A relationship of mutual respect.
Of excitement and wanting to make each other happy!
Forced love is rape. Even in the mental and emotional levels.

So this attitude of "you better say this" bla bla, based on fear and intimidation, is not DELIVERING the right message. These instructions are an ABOMINATION, enveloped in words that seem to add up intellectually.

Lasting marriages are rare, some loose passion or have regular problems, and some are DISASTER.
Still that doesn't invalidate that we need to learn to LOVE and that is what is missing...Hearts are blackened or deadened...who's falut is it?
Let us start by promoting healing.

The reason to forgive is because, if not, you can become, in turn, a harmful influence for others as well.
How do you suppose your mother became like that, adopted that attitude?

They are secret votes and impressions in the heart that do this.
And until you heal you heart you cannot make anyone happy in any new relationship. The best you can do is possibly attract someone else with similar damage and limitations and live feeling the pain and complications resulting from retaining thorns in the heart or remaining weak together.

Not touching this one not a chance

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQFEY9RIRJA

Ivonne,

While I respect almost all of what you say, if you are gifted with the ability to forgive your mother, (if that's a need of yours)you are indeed lucky.

Because of my mothers influence on my formative years, my subsequent personality and more importantly, her continued attempts to abuse me still, I am not ready to yet. No other reason. Maybe when the abuse stops or the final NC happens - Maybe I will - I hope so, I'm not a vengeful person. I actually CAN forgive my PDI(the younger) because I can intellectually work her out and she is no longer an abusing issue in my current life. (NC works).

I understand the failed inner workings of PDI including the many PDIs I have encountered over my life time. I understand why I reacted the way I did, and why i was drawn to the toxic women i am drawn to. I understand how much of this is down to the lack of trust between me and any women I encounter (PDI or not). This is because of the intuitive lack of trust between me and my primary caregiver(mother)during my childhood. In fact a relationship with a PDI is more comfortable if ultimately destructive for me, than a relationship with a non PDI (That lack of trust is my comfort zone). It takes a lot for me to say that out loud. Something I have grown to be able to do and a cycle I need to break for my own well being and the well being of any relationship.

It's only now I know WHY my mother is the way she is - and it's only now I understand the life long damage that has caused her. Understanding is one thing...forgiving is something all together different, especially since the abuse on me is continuing and the many instances where it impacted on my past are only now coming to light, including the deliberate harm my mother did to my first marriage. I'm still processing my anger about much that might have been different or avoided had I known what I know now.

Add to that the way she treated my father during my life time, the emotional and physical; passive and violent abuse, and especially at the end, (seeing another man, going out on dinner dates with him while my father lay dying of cancer in hospital) and you have a whole lot to forgive.

Every person is different - I know that intellectually, and I use intellect to insure i treat each women (indeed person) with the respect THEY deserve, unlike a PDI or feminist who has a very narrow preconceived idea of someone. If they want to believe in a discriminatory world where men and women are prejudged by gender and a totalitarian ideal of how to treat people - that is their issue not mine. In that I agree totally with you. But forgiveness take the pain to stop, and so far with my mother - it hasn't. I will forgive on that day.

Hope that makes sense?

My opinion is if someone asks for forgiveness it's up to you. But without asking screw them they don't deserve to be forgiven.

Forgiveness given too freely is what allowed our tormentors to recycle us again and again. Taken so freely for granted as they do it is a tool used to keep the nonPDI enmeshed.

Round 1...repeat...round 2....repeat until the target gets angry enough to leave and stay gone. That anger fades as the target rebuilds a meaningful life. The target has work to do on their self. Forgiveness is not a free pass out of the he.ll hole of a PDI relationship. Forgiveness requires remorse on the part of the transgresser.

To forgive without requiring the other to change is not only self-destructive, but ensures a dysfunctional relationship will remain so by continually rewarding mistreatment.

In other words since they don't care what's right then they can do no wrong. If you ever expect a heart felt apology it's never going to happen. All you can do is learn from your experience and strive to be the person you are. A good person a honest caring person don't talk about it do it.

just to make it clear i did not intend for this thread to be an argument just wanted to hear everyones damages after their npd relationships gave them. i feel its good to identify what issues you have so repairing can be easier and also maybe find out things from others that u didnt know. and yes i did spew out emotions on my first comment but dang that had to come out, it was eating me alive. ty