So my son has lost yet another job....I know I can't directly pin it on the beast he's with right now but since he's met the vampire, he hasn't been able to stay at a job for over 3 months....in this last one SHE got hired at the SAME place....surprise, she kept her job while he looses his. Before he met her he was a sterling employee who everyone loved.....I don't know what she is doing but I can't help but believe she is doing something.

Since he met her, he has lost his house, all his stuff is in storage (he may loose all that since he may now not be able to pay the bill), looks like crap (she controls all of his clothes and since she's insanely jealous, she only "allows" him to wear stuff that should be donated to Goodwill), has no insurance on his car....and has no contact with us (his parents) or any of his former friends.....

God, why can't he wake up and "smell the coffee" this girl is a possessive, violent, nut job. A good relationship is one that helps BOTH partners and helps them BOTH to grow and be better not worse than they were before.....there are so many nice girls out there and I know there is someone who would truly love him rather than abuse him.

He may be blaming himself for all of the above.

Let me explain this further, the woman I just left was a black belt in this sport. She had me convinced I was the great anti Christ and the reason she and I were miserable was 100% my fault. She blamed everything from coffee(She ended up hiding the coffee pot one morning) to smoking(though she could smoke all she wanted but not me.) Everything was my fault, including her nasty and cruel treatment of me, if I weren't such a horrible person then she wouldn't have to be so cruel and mean! I had driven her to abuse me.

Any argument we had, or issue that cropped up, we would sit there, look at all the pieces and angles until we figured out how it was all my fault. if I didn't agree, man oh man, there was hell to pay.

What I am getting at is, she probably has him blaming himself(And likely you and everyone else who would try to help him in some respects) for the reason why he is in this state. Like the clothes, have you ever asked him, why she recommends these clothes? Try it in a calm and rational manner without reacting and see what he says. Remember if you react or speak ill of her she will use it as ammo against you. She, like the woman I mentioned probably acts like Volcano Goddess with a list of commandments that he must follow "For his own Good." and things he must "sacrifice" in order to appease her. Violate so much as one of these rules and KABOOM!!!!!!!! She will rip his self esteem to shreds, she may not even have to yell to do it either. She may be doing all this to "Help." him or 'because he deserves it." or some other b.s reason.

Just an opinion but speaking as that son and brother whose family literally yelled Halleluiah when I walked out the door leaving her behind, he likely is blaming himself and she is probably encouraging this. Worst of all she may even be playing the whole "I don't know why I put up with you!" Or the whole, "You need me, you can't do it on your own.

My guess is, his self esteem is probably pretty low at this point.

thanks Dave....I am sure you hit it on the nose....now here is the problem....how in the world to we help shore up his lagging self esteem and encourage him, without bad mouthing her (if we were to do that, he would simply defend her) to grow wings and fly????

Why don't you sit down with him and talk to him? Don't be judgmental. If you say anything about his woman you will most likely drive him further from you.

Sit down and ask him what he wants in life, then, help him get back on his feet and get it.

The thing is, for some reason he was vulnerable. She picked up on that vulnerability and took control of him.
Look at his life. Why is he vulnerable to this treatment. Don't be afraid to look at yourselves and your role in this.
Were you controlling?
Did you and your husband overwork?
Did you two value your son based on his accomplishments rather than who he was?
Was he bullied at school?

If you find out the root cause of the problem, then you can address it and start the healing.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to blame anyone. I'm just trying to help.

Careful there, NLB; you're nearly accusing his parents.

While this does have a great effect on a child, there can be a bunch of other possibilities as well :

- is he inexperienced on the relationship level/ is she his first real girlfriend?
That would explain why he tries to keep her so frantically. In this case, he needs more contact with other couples where things go great, and hear their stories, to make him realize what a good relationship is really like.

- is he innocent/naive as a character? He might want to read about emotional abuse, it will open his eyes (it did for me).

- did he always have low self-esteem? If so, it is easy for an abuser to keep him caged. You might wanna bump him up in this case : tell him how much you appreciate seeing him, talking to him, say you're proud to be his parent, and go out of your way to make his visits/calls something special, without becoming needy. He'll realize over time that her version of reality is not his (this one took me 5 years, but I admit being a slow one).

- Other than that, make sure he knows you're always there for him. He'll have to realize by himself what is best for him and what not. (this does not forbid however to prod his friends to convince him of reality).

Let us know how it continues.

THANK YOU, THANK YOU , THANK YOU, JTY.....you really, really helped, After the last reply I have been up night after night worrying thinking this was all my fault...wondering what I should have done....but your insights put it into a much better perspective. Both his father and I are retired educators. His father was retired and available to Aaron 24/7 most of his life....but he is adopted (His mother abandoned him and he has Cystic Fibrosis) put these two pieces in the mix and you can start to see where you hit the mark....she is his first real relationship....she saw an innocent with a huge heart and now she's draining him dry. She talked him into dropping out of college, moving out of the little starter house we bought for him, and takes every penny he earns....if he gets a job she either texts or calls him at work and keeps his life in such chaos that he looses the job.....

Your message helps us know that we are doing as much of the right things as we can. we call, leave messages, send him cards...all with the same message....we love you, we miss you,, you are always welcome in our home.


On the rare occassion he breaks away from her, we try to make a nice meal or watch a movie together....all the while keeping it as peaceful and upbeat as we can....

But we hear from her family members that anytime he spends with us or talks to us, she really takes it out on him and makes him pay for it.

We worry because he has such serious health issues (CF is fatal), and because we know she is too self absorbed to ever care for him if his health goes badly....we pray that if that happens, he will be able to come home to be cared for.

The reality is that Aaron is one of the sweetest people you'd ever meet. When he was little he'd give up any toy he had to help another child....He has told others that she just has had a bad life and he will make it better and that will make her happy. Of course he can't "fix" what he didn't break...and of course she is using that. It is so hard, from a parental side to watch your kid go through this. His father and I have a wonderful friendship and marriage of over 31 years. and we have numerous friends/couples who also have good relationships so he's seen what a good relationship should be.....he is probably trying to make this girl into that...but it itsn't going to happen.

But thank you again for your insight, it really helps. this site really helps. When we see others who have figured it out and gotten out, we know that there is a chance, Aaron will too....we stay hopeful that one day he will walk back through our door.

I myself am adopted.

That could have a huge impact on him.
From my research, I have discovered that people who are adopted have very hard times in their late teen years and when they hit middle age.

This is due to the fact that they don't have a blood history that gives them a bigger identity. To clarify, they don't have a family heritage that belongs to them.
I went through very difficult times in my teen years and at middle age. For basically the same reasons. I didn't have a grasp on who I was.

Plus, I wonder about touch deprivation during different times during the adoption process.

NLB:
All of what you say is possible. I think Aaron has a double whammy issue, Adoption, older parents, and Cystic Fibrosis. It's a lot to handle. He has always kept to his own counsel. He also has ADHD and since he's met the NARC, she's convinced him to not take his concerta, which is a huge mistake. He had a CF/ADHD counselor for years....he has also severed that connection (Although the counselor has offered to talk with him ANYTIME)

I'm sure he has some touch deprivation but he is/was always a very bondable child.

All I know is that he is the light of our lives and we miss him terribly....

I'm sure you do miss him.
I want to apologize about some of my prior questions. I wasn't trying to blame you as a parent. It's just sometimes, we have to really reflect on the entire situation.

I know that as adoptive parents, you probably put some added pressure on yourselves to do a good job.

Did you have any children that weren't adopted?

As far as narcs go, they can smell out a person's weakness and jump all over it. I was always a very giving person. In fact, my boss made a remark to one of my clients that I would give anyone the shirt off of my back.
Well, I view that quality now as a negative one. We have to establish firm boundaries with people. We also have to value what we have and what we produce. If we don't, a narc will come along and take it all. Like my wife did.
I really thought that she was on my side early in our marriage. It was once she got settled in that the mask came off.

Now, as far as your son taking his own council, that can also be a negative thing. He needs to open up and express what he feels and what is going on. The CF perhaps injured him in his psyche. He may feel as though he is a burden to others because of the CF. If you can get him alone, just tell him that you value him for who he is.

One thing that I learned over the years was not to praise my kids too much about their accomplishments. I acknowledge their accomplishments, but their accomplishments are not who they are. I make sure that I tell them that I love them regardless of what they do and how they perform. That way, their inner drive and interests will take over their lives and they will live from within as opposed to living for other people's approval.
Perhaps your son is living for his narc's approval? Maybe she flattered him so much early on that he felt unconditionally loved. If she took that away from him he may be bewildered and trying to win that love back. I know that's what happened to me.

Be patient and loving with him. A woman can cause a man to act in strange ways.

I didn't take any offense to your questions....you are trying to help and we are trying to understand, which is why I posted to begin with. All of the people on this site continue to be a great source of information and support. People keep telling me that he'll be back and I remain ever hopeful that they are right. She is one of the most evil and destructive people I have ever had the misfortune to meet. I know we can't pick our kids friends/relationships but I will always wish I could have in this case.

You are right about it being a negative that he is such a caring and private person. But he is who he is and I love him warts and all.

Keep rooting for my kid and all of the other guys who are victims...these NARC's are nasty.

:)

Terri,

Glad to be of help.

Here's some of my own life experience :

I remember how I viewed the world when I was a late teen, and a lot of it was basically naive ideas of improving the world by being kind to everyone.

In the mean time, I've found out that the world does not work that way. If you're kind, abusers will come and happily take all you give, and then demand more.

This world has a lot of evil people (besides all the good ones), and these days they always come disguised : no, the ugly old man is not the bad one anymore, the bad character now plays the role of the beautiful prince(ss).

Meaning : you have to keep your guard up at all times, and protect yourself by setting limits to how far your kindness goes, and to whom.

A problem for young people is often that they lack experience in relationships, and do not know yet where their boundaries are. Also, they lack the experience to judge someone by their actions.

Especially for a first relationship, you always want to go further for the other person than the next one, because you have not been damaged yet, and also because it takes time to realize what an event really meant. As such, you forgive the other person much more than you should, and you shortsell yourself. This knowledge only comes with experience, and for that, you need to have more relationships under your belt.

For your sons idea of helping her correct her previous bad life : it is a noble cause, but a useless one if it is for the wrong person. Black holes do exist, and one of their features is that they will never fill up, no matter how much rocks you keep throwing in there. Equally, there are blackhole-people in this world, who you can keep filling forever, but it is never enough. Unfortunately, he's with one of those. Some people just cannot be helped, the only thing they will do is drag you down with them.

At the moment, your son falls under the category "Lost boys rescue broken girls" (lost, as in "unknowing", but here I would rather say "inexperienced"). This girl has been broken in her earlier days, and the faults in her brain can never be repaired to make a normal brain again. Her life has been a chain of desperate attempts to survive, no matter who she uses and how. She's living in a no-holds-barred race, and he presents for her an opportunity for a free ride. Of course she'll take it, and will frantically try to keep it; if she loses him, it's back to the line of fire for her.

The only person that can end this is himself. He needs to see through the fog, and realize that what others tell him is something he is free to disagree with. We all have our points of view; the same thing can have a totally different (even opposite) meaning for different people, this is normal in life. The normal thing to do is present your viewpoint in a respectful way, and accept that others have the right to disagree. She does not give him that right, so where does he stand in the relationship?

Some of my ideas here :
- she does not have the right to decide who your son sees and talks to.
- she does not have the right to make him feel bad.
- she does not have the right to decide where he lives.
- she does not have the right to mess up his career.

In summary : this is not a normal relationship, this is slavery.

I would start with demanding that she cannot keep him away from you, non-negotiable. Everyone needs their family ties, and he in his condition even more so. By denying him that, she is only proving what a monster she is.

Second, you need to educate him on the subject of emotional abuse. He does not have experience yet, and this will give him a head start for the rest of his life (I had to find these things out the old way, unfortunately). I've mentioned a good book in one of my messages on this forum in case you need a reference; the videos on this site are also quite enlightening.

The literature will tell the story of his relationship as he reads, and provides answers on how to handle it. At that point, he will be sufficiently educated to see her for what she really is, and her mask will come off big time, or she will run off to the next-in-line.

This reaction has become a bit longer than I expected. Hope it helps, let us know how it goes.

J

Here is a great site concerning emotional abuse. Perhaps you could review some of the materials on it before visiting with your son so you can share them with him.

http://eqi.org/eabuse1.htm

Terri,

You are dealing with a very powerful force.. The Narc will distort reality for her Narcissistic supply victim.

This need of hers to control his every action is part of her disease.. they will literally try to control every part of their victims behavior.

If he sits down.. She will immediately want him to stand and do something

If he likes sushi.. She will insist on never going

This is a very sick person he is entangled with..To a dept that a normal sane person can't comprehend

If I'm being alarming... That is my intention


Narcs are carbon copies of the disease.. meaning they all use the same manipulation... their distorted minds never operate out of the disease

If you were to try and talk to a Narc and point out the characteristics of a Narc and how they are displaying it... they will simply use that information to manipulate further..

NOTHING THEY DO OPERATES OUTSIDE OF THE CONFINES OF THEIR NARCISSISM

One always present characteristic of a Narc is Projection.. They literally can't take the ego hit of a criticism and will then blame you for the fault.

From what I've come to understand.. We can only be responsible for ourselves.. The rest is left to a higher power.. In a way we have to let go and let god take him.. to save our peace

That being said.. I would recommend a book for him to read.

"The Wizard of OZ and other Narcissist"

It is the book that woke me up and gave me the power to leave my wife of 13yrs

I empathize with the pain that this woman, indirectly or directly, is causing you.. These vampires enjoy hurting others and are the very definition of evil

echos to the other replies.. these guys have lived it and have an insight not found anywhere else..

The solution is to vote with his feet. There is no changing or "fixing" the crazy. Doing so will mark him as weak in the eyes of the crazy. Your son needs to speak with guys on here some of whom have walked the talk and come out of it. Mine cost me my home and three years employment. Really Obama? Walmart is going to pull me out of longterm unemployment? Obama is the king narcissist......like the sirens of mythology. Thank you for that dear king.

The key is that he needs to save himself.....no one else can. He can cut the head off medussa or be shat out by the chimera. Up to him in the end. Unfortunately it is in his hands.